Memo to By-By and Bri-Bri: THIS is how you do it
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- TheDukester
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Memo to By-By and Bri-Bri: THIS is how you do it
Christopher Tolkien to oversee production of another of his father's so-called "lost" works, this time a version of a classic Norse legend:
http://www.thecimmerian.com/?p=2763
See, HLP, it's not that hard. It's okay to actually get involved ... you know, with things like making sure your own blood relative's work and legacy is treated with respect and care. It's okay to roll your sleeves up and become part of the process.
Or ... you could just kick back, hire the world's most notorious rent-a-hack to hike out an annual rewrite of one of his failed Star Wars manuscripts, and take those checks to the bank. The only trade-off is forever tarnishing one of the world's literary treasures, but hell with it, right? As long as the checks are on time.
http://www.thecimmerian.com/?p=2763
See, HLP, it's not that hard. It's okay to actually get involved ... you know, with things like making sure your own blood relative's work and legacy is treated with respect and care. It's okay to roll your sleeves up and become part of the process.
Or ... you could just kick back, hire the world's most notorious rent-a-hack to hike out an annual rewrite of one of his failed Star Wars manuscripts, and take those checks to the bank. The only trade-off is forever tarnishing one of the world's literary treasures, but hell with it, right? As long as the checks are on time.
"Anything I write will be remembered and listed in bibliographies on Dune for several hundred years ..." — some delusional halfwit troll.
- Tleszer
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I've been interested in The Ring Cycle since I started studying Wagner's take on it in a music class. I may have to check it out.
Duke, I'm sure JRRT's notes were more extensive than what Bri-Bri and Kev discovered, hence why Chris Tolkien's work on his father's notes don't suck. Then again, there were supposedly 1000s of pages of notes so what do I know.
Duke, I'm sure JRRT's notes were more extensive than what Bri-Bri and Kev discovered, hence why Chris Tolkien's work on his father's notes don't suck. Then again, there were supposedly 1000s of pages of notes so what do I know.
DUNE, as interpreted by a blue man with a green tushie
- Freakzilla
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The notes (found in Brian's garage) and the "Dune 7" outline (safe deposit box) are two seperate things and depending on which interview you want to belive, the outline length ranges from "a detailed and complete outline" to a "2-1/2 page roadmap or guide".Tleszer wrote:Then again, there were supposedly 1000s of pages of notes so what do I know.
I don't think Pinky & The Brian could have done a good job with a trillion pages of notes.
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman
- TheDukester
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I'd argue there's much more to it than that. There's attitude and respect, just to name two. I couldn't give a shit about who has how many pages of notes, where they found them, and if they're any good or not.Tleszer wrote:Duke, I'm sure JRRT's notes were more extensive than what Bri-Bri and Kev discovered, hence why Chris Tolkien's work on his father's notes don't suck.
Christopher Tolkien (and, by extension, whatever literary trust that the Tolkien estate might have set up for various people) has chosen to treat J.R.R.'s work and legacy with respect and care. Christopher is also smart enough to realize that he's not much of a writer and that, even if he were, it would be professional suicide to attempt to "add to" the Lord of the Rings saga with completely new material. Instead, he pours his energy into actively editing and overseeing all aspects of his father's posthumous publications.
Compare and contrast with the Herbert estate. Everything you need to know about these people begins and ends with their hiring of a self-absorbed hack "writer" of X-Files novelizations obsessed with his status in the history of SF writing.
I'm not saying that Christopher Tolkien isn't depositing any checks; of course he is. But he respects the work and the legacy, and he gets involved. He didn't sell his father out in some cynical 10-books-in-10-years fanfic series that allegedly would "add" to the LotR saga.
Last edited by TheDukester on 07 Jan 2009 15:39, edited 1 time in total.
"Anything I write will be remembered and listed in bibliographies on Dune for several hundred years ..." — some delusional halfwit troll.
- Freakzilla
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- TheDukester
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- Freakzilla
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Where Pinky & The Brian are milking the cash cow, contract is probably more apropo.TheDukester wrote:Lawl ... yes, it looks like my digits were flying around the keyboard a bit too quick.
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman
- SandChigger
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- SandRider
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Right after Tolkien died, his son went in to the office at his home,
which was mostly off-limits - he cataloged the material right then
and there, literally boxes and boxes of notes, outlines, old manuscripts,
draft versions on top of draft versions.
Several weeks later he went to Tolkien's office at Oxford and found the
same thing, boxes and boxes of material. All of this material was cataloged.
So the Tolkien estate not only had a lot of material to work
with, they took time to sort thru it, and slowly assembled publication
material.
The first Christoper did of course, was get the Silmarillion into a publishable form, which he did with great apologies.
which was mostly off-limits - he cataloged the material right then
and there, literally boxes and boxes of notes, outlines, old manuscripts,
draft versions on top of draft versions.
Several weeks later he went to Tolkien's office at Oxford and found the
same thing, boxes and boxes of material. All of this material was cataloged.
So the Tolkien estate not only had a lot of material to work
with, they took time to sort thru it, and slowly assembled publication
material.
The first Christoper did of course, was get the Silmarillion into a publishable form, which he did with great apologies.
................ I exist only to amuse myself ................
I personally feel that this message board, Jacurutu, is full of hateful folks who don't know
how to fully interact with people. ~ "Spice Grandson" (Bryon Merrit) 08 June 2008
I personally feel that this message board, Jacurutu, is full of hateful folks who don't know
how to fully interact with people. ~ "Spice Grandson" (Bryon Merrit) 08 June 2008
- dunaddict
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Sigh.... Now that Dune 7/8 is published, what keeps these typing toddlers from releasing that outline, hmm?
No wait, why didn't they include it as an Appendix in Sandworms or Hunters?
Probably because it bears no resemblance whatsoever to the 'story' these two bookmolesters imagined.
I've decided not to buy 'Paul of Dune', but if they published a 'Road to Dune 2' and include the dune 7 outline, I might be persuaded........
No wait, why didn't they include it as an Appendix in Sandworms or Hunters?
Probably because it bears no resemblance whatsoever to the 'story' these two bookmolesters imagined.
I've decided not to buy 'Paul of Dune', but if they published a 'Road to Dune 2' and include the dune 7 outline, I might be persuaded........
- Freakzilla
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They should call it Road from Dune.dunaddict wrote:I've decided not to buy 'Paul of Dune', but if they published a 'Road to Dune 2' and include the dune 7 outline, I might be persuaded........
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman
- SandChigger
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Compare that to what Brian/the Herberts did:SandRider wrote:Right after Tolkien died, his son went in to the office at his home...
Boxed up Frank's things and stuffed them into a garage attic for over ten years.
They're not incredibly bright, this bunch, what?
"Let the dead give water to the dead. As for me, it's NO MORE FUCKING TEARS!"
- SandRider
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If, and I say "if", Brian was in the grips of Drugs and Alcohol and
still working out his feelings towards Frank at that time, I could
cut him a little slack for being stupid. IF that was the case.
Christopher Tolkien on the other hand was an highly educated man
with a sure sense of who his father was and what his father's reputation
was and what his legacy would be.
the whole thing's still sad, tho.
still working out his feelings towards Frank at that time, I could
cut him a little slack for being stupid. IF that was the case.
Christopher Tolkien on the other hand was an highly educated man
with a sure sense of who his father was and what his father's reputation
was and what his legacy would be.
the whole thing's still sad, tho.
................ I exist only to amuse myself ................
I personally feel that this message board, Jacurutu, is full of hateful folks who don't know
how to fully interact with people. ~ "Spice Grandson" (Bryon Merrit) 08 June 2008
I personally feel that this message board, Jacurutu, is full of hateful folks who don't know
how to fully interact with people. ~ "Spice Grandson" (Bryon Merrit) 08 June 2008
- Mr. Teg
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You gotta wonder if the whole thing about the relationship with his father is a marketing gimmick the same as Kevin's hiking or he simply is a very troubled person or both.
Seriously, his identity literally is the son with the bad relationship with his father.
Who presents themselves like that unless they were abused (After how many years did he spend patching things up with his dad and participating in joint projects, but still presents himself as the wounded son?).We all have had our ups and downs with our parents, but we hardly introduce ourselves as such.
If things were that bad, he could've split when he was 18. Maybe he tried, since he mentions hitchhiking in DoD, but returned when he needed money for college and proceded to get drunk which continued even after he got married.
All we are told is his own words that his mom said if forced to make a choice she will side with Frank.
Seriously, his identity literally is the son with the bad relationship with his father.
Who presents themselves like that unless they were abused (After how many years did he spend patching things up with his dad and participating in joint projects, but still presents himself as the wounded son?).We all have had our ups and downs with our parents, but we hardly introduce ourselves as such.
If things were that bad, he could've split when he was 18. Maybe he tried, since he mentions hitchhiking in DoD, but returned when he needed money for college and proceded to get drunk which continued even after he got married.
All we are told is his own words that his mom said if forced to make a choice she will side with Frank.
CHOAM
Combine Herbert Ober Anderson Mercantile, Narf!
Brian, Kevin & Byron The HLP
Combine Herbert Ober Anderson Mercantile, Narf!
Brian, Kevin & Byron The HLP
- SandChigger
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- Freakzilla
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- Robspierre
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- Freakzilla
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I knew a redneck dude, a fire alarm installer, who named his kids Hunter and Fisher. I hope they turn out to be vegitarians.Robspierre wrote:When my dad was a heli-attack forman in Washington, one of his crew named his daughter Chivas after the blended scotch
Rob
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman
- Freakzilla
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- Freakzilla
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If it's a boy he could go by 'Cid.Baraka Bryan wrote:but she could go by Mari and avoid embarrassment.
name them cocaine... Acid...Meth
hard to avoid those what's acid gonna go by? Ass?
The hillbillies on The Simpsons named their daughter Crystal Meth.
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman
- Hunchback Jack
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Not just editing and publishing, but actually analysing the texts, trying to determine the precise order that the drafts were written in, what changes in plot and characters occurred, and to understand what his father's reasons were for the changes.TheDukester wrote:Christopher Tolkien (and, by extension, whatever literary trust that the Tolkien estate might have set up for various people) has chosen to treat J.R.R.'s work and legacy with respect and care. Christopher is also smart enough to realize that he's not much of a writer and that, even if he were, it would be professional suicide to attempt to "add to" the Lord of the Rings saga with completely new material. Instead, he pours his energy into actively editing and overseeing all aspects of his father's posthumous publications.
Christopher Tolkien is the literary executor of his father's estate. His father tasked him to do this work, and he clearly takes that responsibility *very* seriously indeed.
From the admittedly short description of the new book, it sounds like there's more than just "notes" to go on; there may just be some draft manuscripts that need to be put in order. Should be very interesting.
What the HLP is doing in constrast is just appalling.
HBJ
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Absolutely.Hunchback Jack wrote:Christopher Tolkien is the literary executor of his father's estate. His father tasked him to do this work, and he clearly takes that responsibility *very* seriously indeed.
An interesting example will be the completion of Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time series. As some may be aware he passed away just over a year ago leaving the series uncompleted. He had however left notes, dictated large parts of the story and had passed on the complete ending (which he had known since the beginning of the series). The project has been given to an author who has been a fan of the books since they first began, apparently they inspired him to become an author in the first place.
Now, I don't want to pre empt what may come out of this, the last book might be great or it might be simply good. What I do know is that there has been from the start of the project an obvious and abiding respect for the legacy & intentions of Rober Jordan. It's incredibly sad and frustrating to know that the Herbert's had this opportunity also and decided to instead sell the legacy of one of the greatest authors of the 20th century.
- cmsahe
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Poor little girl, and even worse when she comes to Mexico for a vacation everyone will laugh at "Ms goats". (chivas means goats in spanish)Robspierre wrote:When my dad was a heli-attack forman in Washington, one of his crew named his daughter Chivas after the blended scotch
Rob
Only the books written by Frank Herbert are canon.
Who We Are and What We Stand For
viewtopic.php?p=79778#p79778
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Carlos Santillan, aka cmsahe
Who We Are and What We Stand For
viewtopic.php?p=79778#p79778
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Carlos Santillan, aka cmsahe